Wednesday, May 6, 2015

A Squall of Tears

An Agent's EVEmail inbox can be a disturbing place.
From: JennyJane Dulic
Sent: 2015.04.22 20:08
To: Chocolate Mooses,

The New Order has made great strides in highsec, but we still have a long way to go. Currently, not every carebear has fully adapted to the changes we've brought their way. As a result, our Agents understand that not everyone they gank will be happy about it.

Agents Chocolate Mooses and The Occidental killed Rinoa Stark's typical, bot-aspirant, yield-fit Hulk, along with her inexpensive pod. A few minutes later, Chocolate was invited to join a private conversation with a fellow named Squall Targarian.
Chocolate Mooses > Good morning, what's up?
Squall Targarian > go fuck yourselves.....I hope you all live terrible lives for real. You are scum and complete fucking ass holes
Chocolate quickly surmised that Squall was the alt of the Hulk pilot she'd just ganked. She also began to have very real doubts about Squall's intention to obey the Code in the future.
Chocolate Mooses > Wow, hold up a second?
Chocolate Mooses > You do realize you are playing a video game about space ship combat, right? There's no need for that type of launguage.
Chocolate Mooses > Please try to calm down.
Squall Targarian > that's right, i hope all the bad things in life happen to you and I wish i had a chance to make your life a living hell. Just be glad I can't find you in RL you piece of shit
As is standard practice, the ganked miner was instructed to calm down. But he didn't. If anything, the miner only became less calm. Chocolate couldn't believe what she was reading.
Chocolate Mooses > What would you do if you found me in RL?
Squall Targarian > probably a lot of property damage....I don't think you're worth hurting physically
Chocolate Mooses > Oh, that's not very friendly at all. Do you normally make threats of RL property damage when you lose a internet spaceship in a video game about internet spaceships engaging in combat?
Squall Targarian > yea a game about space combat although i was not in a combat vessel and you get nothing from killing me except the fact that you got to piss me off. If i was in a combat vessel you wouldnj't even hear from me
Like so many other bot-aspirant miners, Squall believed it was inappropriate for him to be blown up while in a non-combat ship. In other words, he felt highsec miners should be completely invincible unless they choose to pilot a non-mining ship. Chocolate disagreed. After all, Squall had been playing EVE for nearly 4 years, and had spent the entire time mining. Chocolate couldn't wait for Squall to get into a combat ship. He had to PvP now.
Chocolate Mooses > You don't need to be "pissed". Once you calm down you should consider a mining permit, a written apology to me for your RL threats, and a personal apology to James 315 and the Mittani for your behavior.
Squall Targarian > HAH fuck you. oh that was so friendly of you sucide ganking my hulk...wanna get together later for lunch!?
Chocolate Mooses > No, considering you have already made real life threats against me, I would not enjoy having lunch with you. Thanks for the offer, however!
Squall Targarian > go fuck yourself
Squall's tears continued to rain down and flood the private chat. Normally, at this point a miner would pivot to a demand for reimbursement, or argue about the finer points of the Code, or vow to call in powerful nullsec friends, or threaten to petition CCP. Squall wasn't even calm enough to do that yet.
Chocolate Mooses > Just try to calm down. You have already issued RL threats of property damage over a video game, let's not get even more crazy about it.
Squall Targarian > think there's something wrong with me but your trying to paint me as the bad guy yet you not only destroyed an expensive ship but you cap killed me, now i have 24 jumps to get back here.....
Chocolate Mooses > You just threatened property damage in real life. It's not my fault you have your medical clone 24 jumps from here, or that you can't watch local or your directional scanner.
Incredibly, Squall saw himself as the hero in this scenario. He was particularly upset about being podded 24 jumps away from his favorite asteroid belt. Apparently, after nearly 4 years in the game, Squall never bothered to settle down in the system with his favorite highsec ore. He was still looking for a better deal.
Squall Targarian > it's just you venting your weird need to be an ass
Chocolate Mooses > You fight back in a hulk by not being on grid when I get there. Also, a simple mining permit would have avoiding this entire thing. This is what CCP calls "Emergent Gameplay" and "The Sandbox"
Squall Targarian > I work 12 hours a day, then cook for my mom, and would like to actually play the game for the couple hours i get but you sir have ruined that for me.
Finally, Squall calmed down enough to begin making excuses for his behavior. He explained that he only has a few hours a day to play EVE. Chocolate didn't believe him: If Squall were interested in playing the game, what was he doing mining in highsec? In nearly 4 years, Squall had never played the game. Chocolate couldn't accept the blame for that.
Chocolate Mooses > PVP is a normal part of this video game.
Chocolate Mooses > If you are not into that, may I suggest a alternative title like "Minesweeper" or "Solitare"?
Squall Targarian > you ganked me bitch, no pvp was involved
Chocolate Mooses > Well, you're a player, right? I am a player also.
Chocolate Mooses > Don't take it so personal! Get a permit, fit a tank, show some situational awareness.
Squall Targarian > haha you really are a shitty person.....I retract all my awful comments because people like you will never be able to exist outside of the realm of these video games where you get to be a big shot. Thanks for ruining my day ass hole
In the end, Squall took back his insults and real-life threats, albeit in one of the more questionable apologies I've seen lately. The squall had passed. Perhaps a sunnier future lies ahead for the miner. Then again, another storm could be right around the corner.


  1. Minging? Is that what miners are calling what I do nowadays?

    1. The man who came up with "minging" is a cunning linguist!

    2. "minging" is a word used by british military personnel to describe something that is dirty, or unpleasant.

      Verb, present continuative tense of ming, q.v.

      1. smelly
      2. ugly
      3. drunk, (usu. used in relating last night's events)
      4. generally distasteful, Someone who is minging is also a minger, q.v.

      This word is widely used in the North of England and Scotland.

    3. Minging fits perfectly for ming then! :D

  2. Good ole Choco never fails to root out the angry miners!

    Miner is naming his chars after Final Fantasy and Game of Thrones characters, but I am saddened to see he misspelled the illustrious name of Targaryen. This miner is no true dragon, that's for sure.

  3. Chocolate Mooses > What would you do if you found me in RL?

    Err... I hope everyone knows that this type of baiting about RL threats can get both players permabanned. Not just the player making the threats, but also the player that is on the receiving end of the threats, if he/she was actively baiting the player into making specific RL threats. CCP is not very tolerant on this particular subject, and role-playing definitely is not considered an acceptable excuse.

    Keep RL out of the game, people....

    1. Please do not take quotes out of context.

      In the line before the one you quote and get dramatic about, the miner said that our hero should be glad that he cannot find him in RL.

      So this was not "baiting" but just trying to clarify, and give the butthurt miner a chance to retract his evil threat.

    2. Only a carebear would see person A threaten person B irl, person B ask again if person A meant irl (to give them a chance to walk it back), and say person B is at fault for "baiting" person A. I hope Chocolate Mooses petitioned this dangerously-disturbed carebear.

    3. "So this was not "baiting" but just trying to clarify..."

      CCP has banned players who used this excuse. RL threats are a verboten topic for in-game discussions.

    4. "Only a carebear would see person A threaten person B irl, person B ask again if person A meant irl (to give them a chance to walk it back), and say person B is at fault for baiting person A"

      No, this has nothing to do with carebears, high sec, ganking, etc. CCP has made it clear that certain topics have a zero-tolerance policy for in-game discussion. This happens to be one of those topics.

      Chocolate Mooses can submit a petition, but continuing the discussion with Squall Targarian, whether to supposedly "clarify" or "give someone a chance to walk it back" (either case is unlikely - Chocolate was clearly engaging in role-playing), puts him/her at risk for a ban, as well.

      tldr; If someone issues a RL threat in game, report it to CCP. Do not discuss the matter with that player any further.

    5. @anon8:10
      On the contrary.

      Who are you to judge when an Agent of the New Order must end a conversation?

      Carebears routinely give Agents the very rope from from which they hang freely, and all the Agent does is listen and attempt to clarify a miner's intent.

      Forget not that the New Order is, at its core, a reformatory organization. And that it is preferable for Agents to attempt to reform the Carebear without having to resort to such tactics as involving CCP. We would rather that they just pay up. We aren't snitches.

      But, sometimes, like a family member that watches their father beat their mother one too many times, sometimes we have no choice but to involve the law. Because RL threats are real, and we have no choice. If the miner is doing something that we expressly told it not to do, we will not stand by and perjure ourselves on the stand; we will faithfully stand and tell CCP the truth and ensure that the carebear receives the justice it deserves for its actions.

    6. He/She is obviously someone more intelligent than you ming...btw, did you man up yet?

    7. Ming @ 9:07 said: Forget not that the New Order is, at its core, a reformatory organization.

      That was a typo on its part, it ment to say "The new order is at its core in need of reform, as an organization."

    8. I filed no support ticket against him. I have never once filed a support ticket against anyone in over eight years of playing EVE Online. People making real life threats against me does not bother me one bit. I try to be understanding, and let's be real here I think all of us can agree that some players do not have the emotional maturity to handle the loss of a spaceship in a PVP game and will act all loopy and nutty lol. I don't feel the need to appeal to CCP to somehow "protect me" from this type of behavior. If someone really was serious about doing property damage to me in real life, I could care less. All my stuff is insured and can be replaced with no loss to me, and that would become a matter for local authorities. I've met scores of players who feel the need to make threats like this, and never once has anyone acted on them. They are just being angry and lack the ability to express themselves.

      For those who were commenting about my decision to ask "What would you do if you found me in RL?", it should be plainly obvious to anyone that I was not trying to bait anything about of this miner. Another agent already nailed it, however. The comment was "So this was not "baiting" but just trying to clarify, and give the butthurt miner a chance to retract his evil threat" which is very accurate. I simply wanted to drive home the point of how silly it is to issue RL threats over actions in a video game. It's also vital to mention that I don't talk to my targets after they explode in any way, this target opened a conversation with me.

      Let me state this once more for the record. In my many years of playing EVE online, I have never once felt the need to report the actions of any other player to CCP. If someone bothers me, or in the case of Squall here takes things way too far, I simply end the conversation on a positive and hopefully friendly note and add them to my block list. Antimatter based communication still works quite well against players like this.

    9. @ anon 7:28. Oh..okay, I see. So by your's woman's fault for being raped because she baited the man by looking pretty...or's the banks fault for being robbed because they baited the robber by having all that money...or maybe's the murder victims fault because they baited the murderer to kill them by being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it...because it is. There was no baiting here..the threats were made beforehand..not after he asked. To play devil's advocate..even if, by some chance, he was baiting...where is the responsibility for ones own self control or lack thereof. Stop trying to twist something to look different than what it is because you don't agree with how it got to that point to begin with. It is what it is..accept appalled..but place your distaste where it belongs..with the one making the threats..regardless of what "made" him do it.

    10. @ Kaely Kakes
      (Different anon here) I think that what anon 7:28 meant was that since CCP hands out the bans and, as he relates us, they don't care about the reasons why somebody mentions or even discusses RL threats, it's just best to report the player as soon as he/she makes a RL threat or end the convo. Even if, from a moral point of view, the agent is, of course, on the good side, CCP might still ban both players and not care about details.

      This, of course, stands on the assumption that the aforementioned way is the way CCP operates. I just wanted to clarify, what I think the anon wanted to say. Have a nice and Code compliant day everyone! :)

  4. Wow, that was awesome! Based on that performance, I'm guessing Squall Targarian probably has a social issue or two irl.

    The Code always wins!! \o/

  5. meh seems made up

  6. A petition should be placed on both. On the miner for the real life threats and on the ganker for encouraging said real life threats.

    1. Incorrect. If the "ganker" you are referring to is a New Order Agent, then he or she is not "encouraging real life death threats." New Order Agents only "encourage" adherence to the Best Management Practices that one can follow: Compliance with the Code and Loyalty to James 315.

      We most certainly are not "encouraging" real life death threats from the miner. It does that on its own, due to its inability to control its temper when faced with opposition to its indecency.

    2. Well, there is just no way that is going to happen fool...

    3. To bad ming cant include itself as an agent, considering all it does is post.

    4. @ anom 10:33, bet ming has a better killboard then you, hell I bet that I have a better killboard then you...

    5. Well considering ming does not have any killboard activity in nearly the last year, i think that speaks volumes about how 'effective' it is.

    6. Good catch @12:50AM...ming is a paper tiger....

    7. quite honestly, james 315 is even worse. Like 2.5 years with no pvp activity on his killboard.

    8. @anon 9.14 pm

    9. @ minger
      we all know you guys "encourage" those outrageous outbursts the carebears are prone to, so stop bullshitting.

    10. 9:14pm If the player in question has any problem with my actions they can take it up with CCP.

      2:12am see above thread. I never made any contact with this miner, he came to me after normal PVP combat. If your issue was with me asking "What would you do if you found me in RL" you will clearly see that I answered this already in this very article.

    11. Anon 9:14..are you serious? Chocolate Mooses did nothing wrong. In fact, he remained civil and calm throughout the entire encounter. His ganking of the miners ship was not wrong, a part of the game, and encouraged. Just because someone disagree with something, does not make the other person wrong. Just because someone is too weak to protect themselves, does not make the other a bully. This miner is a perfect example of what is wrong in Eve...not the ganker. I will never understand why someone gets so emotional over's a game. You win some, you lose some...and you will never win if you don't actually play the game or takes steps to protect yourself. "I want to cause physical harm to you or cause rl property damage because I lost my spaceship in a game about spaceship conflict"...get a clue...what a loser.

    12. ^^^ in that last sentence, I am referring to Squall...just to be my words aren't twisted. that is all...xoxox

    13. Looks like the try-hards are again trying hard to spin the blame off of them, where it belongs. Chocolate Moses was nothing but polite and correct.

    14. you people both instigate and encourage ALL the reactions you get.
      stop bullshitting again... his RL threats were said in anger (thats what some people do unfotunately when they get pissed off, and code pisses people off all the time)
      your "agent" then tried to leverage even more venom from him with what was a leading question.
      i mean really? if someone says they are going to physically attack you for whatever reason who then asks"oh really so what you gonna do to me then?
      it's simple he got mad your "agent" wanted to prolong the incident because it's fun to you code people so he tried to aggravate the situation.
      giving you lots of ammunition to do the "oh look how bad miners are making RL threats again" you instigate the anger then complain when you get it(however over the top that anger may be ) it's codes modus operandi.

    15. @Anon2:59

      If you think the agent was wrong and broke CCP's rules, then by all means, send in a petition and see what happens. If not, get over it and move on cause you are not making any points that will you the argument here.
      Put up or shut up.

    16. @2:59PM Two points.

      1) Some people "unfortunately" beat their family members when they get "pissed off". That does not make it an acceptable behavior. Dishing out weird RL threats over a video game is not acceptable behavior.

      2) I never "encouraged" any type of threats. Read the story again. This player made his threat after engaging ME in conversation (I don't open conversations with my targets) and all I had said was:

      "Chocolate Mooses > Good morning, what's up?"
      "Chocolate Mooses > Wow, hold up a second?"

      So your argument now falls apart. The ONLY interaction I had with him before his RL threats was shooting his spaceship. He opened a conversation with me. He "instigated" this. As you can see from the chat log, I provided no "encouragement" beyond saying hello, he opened with his poor choice of words.

      Next time please read more carefully, then post.

    17. you asked him the leading question thats all you needed to do.(thats encouragement)
      what you do engenders the kind of response you got(which is exactly the response you want).
      you feign politeness and use condescension and smugness, to create an almost instant belligerance from someone who you have just inflicted yourself upon and attacked.
      you then exacerbate the situation by making feeble attempts to calm them down (which is the exact opposite of what you really want to do).
      all while pretending to be some kind of "heroic" and just figure.
      you attack someone then blithely say "hello whats up ?"
      really? then expect to be seen as the "good guy" because you have pissed someone off enough to get that reaction (which is what you wanted anyway).
      and his "poor choice of words" was created by your actions .

    18. No, friend. A miner is responsible for his own actions, even when he's recently lost at pvp. Losing a fight doesn't excuse people from their responsibility to behave in a civilized and decent manner. And being spoken to politely after losing a fight does not somehow make rudeness in their reply more acceptable.

      Everyone is responsible for their own behavior, even if they're "angry" or "frustrated". How can you deny your responsibility for your own actions? That responsibility is the foundation for all moral systems. If you deny miners that responsibility, all possibility of ethics collapses.

    19. maria if i'm minding my own business doing what i enjoy doing (even if that is mining) and someone comes up and attacks me for no other reason than the fact that they can,i am rightly going to be severely pissed off, now i'm not going to issue real life death threats because i like to think i am a sensible mature human being with consideration for the wellbeing and health of others.

      having said that you (you being code) seem to think that after being attacked by some random individual for no apparent reason, these individuals some of which are more agressive in nature than others are supposed to have a polite conversation and even thank you for attacking them, you cannot possibly think thats the reaction your going to get from the majority of them (if that was so this blog would not exist for one) plus i don't believe you want them to anyway really.anger is anger, the fact it is engendered by the loss of some pixels may seem odd to most of us, but the fact is you made them angry then you seek to mock and ridicule and make demands of them to anger them even further.

    20. Maria Malukker said some who attack peaceful ppl GJ GJ (RETARD)

    21. @ anom 9:06

      Can you please restate the above sentence in English? I'm sorry, but I don't understand gibberish.

    22. Ok, there seems to be some confusion here, let me try again.

      7:37PM you failed to actually read what I typed and check the original conversation. Again, I made no contact with this target beyond normal PVP.


      Chocolate Mooses > Good morning, what's up?
      Squall Targarian > go fuck yourselves.....I hope you all live terrible lives for real.
      Chocolate Mooses > Wow, hold up a second?
      Chocolate Mooses > You do realize you are playing a video game about space ship combat, right? There's no need for that type of launguage.
      Chocolate Mooses > Please try to calm down.
      Squall Targarian > that's right, i hope all the bad things in life happen to you and I wish i had a chance to make your life a living hell. Just be glad I can't find you in RL you piece of shit

      Now, show me where I asked a single leading question that somehow forced the poor helpless miner into making RL threats. I could see someone trying to argue that my question that I asked after RL threats were made was "leading" (that someone would still be wrong, I had no need to lead this horse to water, it was doing just fine on it's own!) but as I explained, I was simply being polite and trying to give them a chance to walk back their RL threat and actually think about what they just said. You also seem to think that I "fiegn politeness" and I think you are confused, I am actually polite to everyone. It's the decent human thing to do. Also, yes, if someone opens a conversation with me I may very well say "Hello, what's up?".. how is that rude or wrong? Of the very few people who open a conversation with me after losing a ship to me (be it in highsec, low, null or wspace) almost every time it's to say something like "lol good fight" or "damn! you got me! grrrrr goons grrr code" or "what was your fit" or something along these lines. That's the overwhelming majority. Behavior like "squall" showed is very weird and rare. Yes, I understand I was the "aggressor" in a fight, but this is a video game and fighting is kind of the core thing in the video game, it's not like I did anything rude by blowing up his hulk and podding him. There's nothing personal or rude about PVP.

      tl;dr getting your spaceship shot up does not justify RL threats, regardless of what spot in space it happens in. getting your spaceship shot up is a everyday normal part of eve. shooting up someone's spaceship is not "provoking" RL threats. thanks for reading.

    23. 8:37pm


      I've blown up about 3/4 of a trillion ISK of miners and haulers, and of the very few who decide to open a conversation with me afterwards almost every single one is totally cool, polite, and just wants to ask some questions about something or wonders what fit I used or wants to give a "good fight" or a "lol damn you, you got it" or something else silly and friendly.

      being angry after losing a fight in eve is weird as hell, and in your case if getting attacked in eve makes you "severely pissed off" you might want to consider a break, or another game or taking some time to really think about it. you're actually the rare special snowflake here, very very few people in eve get pissed off or angry when they explode. most of us and almost every single player I have ever met in eight years of internet spaceships understands that at some point, there will be a fight that you will lose, your ship will explode, and have learned to enjoy that and find it awesome and see it for what it is, you know, part of the grand circle of life and all that jazz.

      please don't try to play yourself off like you are the majority of people, and that getting "severely pissed off" over pvp is what the majority of people do. it's disingenuous at best and kindof goes to show that you may wish to take a moment to really ask yourself why what happens in a silly video game about internet spaceships makes you "severely pissed off" from time to time. like, i used to get really pissed off at video games, but the last time it happened the game was "super mario brothers" and I was like twelve years old or something.

    24. mooses 10.21 am
      kinda missed the important bit

      "now i'm not going to issue real life death threats because i like to think i am a sensible mature human being with consideration for the wellbeing and health of others."

      i too live in null and have died quite a lot and no i don't make RL death threats.
      being the adult that i am my "severely pissed off " possibly stretches to the odd swear word at my screen.
      you also ignore the fact i said some people are more agressive than others, this unfortunately is true (we cannot all be paragons of virtue which is what you people seem to think you are).
      i can also assure you i have heard some "severely pissed off " people on various ts servers lose their shit big time from time to time (they are only human aftyer all).
      add to that the fact that you inflict yourself upon people who want nothing to do with you,and then make demands for isk and gf''s then it is highly likely some of them go over the top (that why this blog is here)
      as for me not being the "majority" that may be true as i live where most don't pay you any attention at all, but every high sec resident i have ever spoken to that is aware of code gets all "hot under the collar" about you and not in a good way .

    25. @chocolate mooses
      you still asked the question.(before or after becomes irrelevant once you ask it)
      and you asked it to provoke more of the violent reaction you got or "tears" as you people like to call them. and then you act all indignant when they give you what you seek.
      you like the reactions you get thats why you do what you do .

    26. ps .
      your "politeness" is just another tool you use to get the victims even more agitated for your amusement.

    27. Do you believe it's possible for people to be polite for reasons other than "they're trying to provoke people into making real-life threats"?

    28. indeed maria in most cases that is correct,alas not in the case of some of you code people (note i say some not all).some use politeness to aggravate in a sneering way and it shows. like your trademark saying "calm down miner" is designed to irritate.

    29. chocolate mooses

      "I've blown up about 3/4 of a trillion ISK of miners and haulers, and of the very few who decide to open a conversation with me afterwards almost every single one is totally cool, polite, "

      did you ever wonder that it is only a very few because most of them want nothing to do with you,they think that your a dick. and are your just being a douche because you can,thats why they don't convo you ?

  7. looks like your typical anti-ganker

  8. "we will not stand by and perjure ourselves on the stand; we will faithfully stand and tell CCP the truth and ensure that the carebear receives the justice it deserves for its actions."

    Ming Tso, this is where you fall down. To all miners you now see how the New Order refers to you. Your all (It's) according to mighty Ming. If you want to make a mining name for yourself then feel free to mine in the free systems of Panorad where a name you will gain.
    Fly Safe.

    1. nothing mighty about minger you give him waaaaay too much credit my friend.

    2. Ming is nothing but a creepy looking very vocal cheerleader for code.
      Now if it would undock and do some actual fighting, but it (ming) is to scared of doing that.

  9. This comment has been removed by the author.

  10. meh definitely made up

    1. I calculate that there is a 99% chance that you are a Veers alt.


    Squall got one thing right - a glorious Code warrior is a happy warrior.

  12. Everything you need to know about carebears is pretty much summed up in their language and RL threats.

  13. funny is CODE said "THIS IS GAME" but when you read code you see mining is bad and you waste your RL time and mining is not fun..... :D:D

    dont know but its like nazi or ISIL

    1. Carebear reads the Code
      Opens eyes but not the mind
      Real time is wasted

    2. the real question, 1:43pm is

      THEN WHO WAS PHONE!!????


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