We've talked a lot about space lawyers, people who confidently assert their interpretation of the EULA, even when it contradicts CCP's. The most common mistake space lawyers make is the assumption that bumping miners must be against the EULA, and that they can get the New Order permabanned from the game. Space law schools are turning out a lot of graduates these days, and it seems every other day a brand new one appears to tell us our business is illegal.
I estimate that more than 500 separate petitions have been filed against Agents of the New Order. Every one of those petitions has been denied. However, CCP has always shied away from publicly affirming the legitimacy of miner bumping--until now.
It began with a simple post on EVE-O entitled "Miner bumpers and suicide gankers..." posted by Remiel Pollard.
I invite you to the Osnins constellation, particularly the Halle system, to stir up some trouble. Seriously, it's like a ghost town out here. I'm ratting a 'roid field right now and there are three barges sitting here doing nothing, there is a noob Heron sitting here... doing nothing. They've been doing nothing for near on five minutes now, and this is COMMON to find in these systems. So I am inviting you to come and stir trouble at your own convenience. Have fun!!It's noteworthy that miner bumping is mentioned in the same breath as suicide ganking--in fact, before it. Prior to the New Order, organized miner bumping simply did not exist. Now it is an accepted part of highsec life. Anyway, a few replies down the thread, a member of the CCP staff chimed in:
Developer CCP Eterne made a harmless joke. But because he used the word "griefing" to describe miner bumping and suicide ganking, some EVE pilots became alarmed. Greifing can refer to a practice that violates the EULA, but it can also be used informally to describe a practice that causes grief. In some games, any combat outside of mutually-agreed-upon PvP would be called griefing. This is why people sometimes say things like "griefing is allowed, even encouraged, in EVE Online". Eterne clarified.
Eterne confirmed that he didn't use the word "griefing" to mean a EULA violation. Then he went a step further: "It's not a petitionable action." Like suicide ganking, miner bumping is not a petitionable action!
There was no mistaking it: An official representative of CCP publicly stated that bumping miners is not petitionable. Now we can put all those space lawyers out of business! When they begin plying their trade, simply link this MinerBumping post and let them spin out of control.
*** UPDATE *** In response to this post, CCP has gone a step further toward making it totally clear that bumping miners is legitimate. No less than developer CCP Falcon himself had the following to say in this post:
So, I just spoke to the GM Team regarding this to get some clarification:So there you have it! The New Order is legal, always has been, and always will be. Cue the tears of space lawyers everywhere.
Firstly, people who are bumped always have the right to petition. It is the right of any player who feels that they want to petition an issue to do so.
However, with regards to the rules in EVE Online our current view is:
- Bumping is not considered harassment.
- Bumping is not considered griefing.
- Bumping is not against the rules.
It's actually been used for a long time to prevent warping as a rudimentary form of tackling when you don't have a point, or don't have sufficient disruption strength to keep someone pinned.
Along with that, the people that are doing this for the best part are in player corporations. If you don't like what they're doing, declare war on them so that you can punish them, or pay a merc corp to do so on your behalf if you don't want to fight.
There are plenty of options to counter this, if you use your imagination.
Oh my, that's awesome there. Does that also warrant a change to miner bingo?ReplyDelete
Miners will still petition us, after all not all are stupid enough to publicly announce it and will never be educated sadly.Delete
This is not quite the tool for crushing the will of the resistance we've been asking for, as the word "informally" may be enough for die-hard rebels to maintain their grip on their silly fantasy, but I'll take it. :)ReplyDelete
Huh, the word informally is used in a completely different sentence, in reference to an earlier post. It actually makes the case stronger, as it boils down to mean 'that was informal before, but now, formally and officially: bumping is not petitionable'. If the miners can't understand that, then they wouldn't be able to understand God himself speaking from the heavens, and only bumping will change their minds.Delete
That is the issue, most miners position towards The New Order is similar to how sane people refer to gods, as in "don't feed me that crap."Delete
There is a difference however, as the New Order is taking real action and making changes to people lives.
I'd like to start a formal motion that CCP Eterne be made an honorary member of the New Order for giving us Agents even more things to link to in local when the griefing accusations fly.ReplyDelete
I'm going to personally make an edit on my bio; "CCP Eterne said I could".Delete
Tbh the CCP Eterne answer is absolutely fantastic. After all maybe there is still hope for Eve.ReplyDelete
Oh ok, THIS is the spirit crushing tool I was hoping for: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=173086&p=2 CCP Falcon cuts out all ambiguity!ReplyDelete
This comment has been removed by the author.ReplyDelete
Removed quote since James added it to his blog.Delete
Excellent news. Of course in the New Order we already knew we were doing God's work. Great to see CCP back us to the hilt.ReplyDelete
James 315, CCP Falcon has added a response I think you should include in this latest blog post.ReplyDelete
Done and done!Delete
ALL HAIL THE NEW ORDER, THE ONE TRUE AND LEGITIMATE AUTHORITY IN THE ICE FIELDS OF HIGH SEC!ReplyDelete
Cue Queen: "Weeeeeee are the champions my friendsssssssss..."ReplyDelete
ALL HAIL THE NEW ORDER!ReplyDelete
On the forum, user NEONOVUS posted:ReplyDelete
"Just to be clear, if they continue to stock you across several systems, and continue to bump you until you buy a permit, that is/not harassment?"
If a wartarget stalks me across half of highsec and persists in doing so until either my ship is destroyed or I pay a ransom C that is/not harassment?
While my opinion of the New Order is quite clear from a sceenshot included in the most recent pst, I have to say I'm somewhat saddened by this announcement by CCP. I much preferred the previous ambiguity of the issue, which would give rise to numerous petitions and their related space lawyering. As of today, all an agent must now do is link to CCP Falcon's post to quiet all but the most vocal and die hard of the space lawyering types. I fear in the end the ease with which the petition issue can be resolved will infringe upon the entertainment to be had from the New Order's activities.ReplyDelete
Of course, I could be entirely wrong. Perhaps this little informal announcement of CCP's support for bumping will usher in a tsunami of tears.
> ...little informal announcement of CCP's support...Delete
What do you mean by "informal?" :D
It was never ambiguous nor informal at all. CCP's opinion on the matter is quite clear & is available for all to read on their support website.Delete
It won't impact the Order. It's only 1 spot on the bingo card and even then, it will still warrant that spot. Don't really need to link to Falcon's post. Link them here as normal.Delete
Save the Space Lawyers!!ReplyDelete